dr. tom wrote:

....Does the study mention this? No, Alex, it does not explicit mention it but it implies it!
That 2SO will increase the HFRR value of fuel is common knowledge and is not subject to any further scientific research.

Thank you for the clarification...
In my opinion, something is becoming common knowledge when many things have been said, done and experimented on it.
But, strangely, until now, not a single study (that we know about it), has been done on this 2SO addition, for diesel HP pumps lubrication purposes...
Ah, sorry, some have implied it.... No offence!

PS: More of that, on many 2SO bottles I've seen, there is a clear statement like this: "Do not use as fuel or add to diesel!"... I wonder why, if the contrary is common knowledge without the need for further research...

PPS: I yearn for the day when somebody will hit me in the head with a study that proves that the 2SO is good for lubrication purposes in the particular case of a high pressure diesel injection pump...

But/or as BossBob has said: "Whether it has any effect in the hp fuel pump (good or bad) of a diesel we won't know until someone strips down a couple of comparably used engines that have and have not used 2 stroke oil."

Indeed Alex.
What we have seenu is only that 2SO has been used as a lubricant very successfully when used in its pure state undiluted by fuel on SILK motorcycle, but, we have seen no evidence of what or if something happens to 2SO when it is mixed with a fuel before it gets to a lift pump, HP pump or injectors.

Does the dilution of the 2SO in those circumstances negate the proven lubrication capabilities as already discussed

Let us put science aside and apply common sense:
as athelstan has in detail explained, 2SO will lubricate mechanical components and than burn as a mixture of petrol and 2SO.
Adding the dosis of 2SO to the diesel will better the lubrication properties by the factor x and will for sure not decrease the lubrication. The mixture of diesel and 2SO will burn - both are made to burn in comparison to normal engine oil, where burning is a undesired process and to be avoided.
Personally I cannot see any reason - scientifically proven or not - to doubt the positive impact of adding the dosis of 2SO to the diesel to assist in the tribological effect.

Well there's lots of tech debate going on, but I thought I'd now feedback into the forum as I've been adding TSO to my GS since May. I'm not sure that it has made the car run smoother or quieter but, but there has been no adverse effects and my MPG has gone from an average of 38.6 to 40.5. So even given any inaccuracy re the on board computer (which has been the subject of other threads on here) fuel economy seems to be a definite benefit!

dr. tom wrote:

Personally I cannot see any reason - scientifically proven or not - to doubt the positive impact of adding the dosis of 2SO to the diesel to assist in the tribological effect.

IanH wrote:

Well there's lots of tech debate going on, but I thought I'd now feedback into the forum as I've been adding TSO to my GS since May. I'm not sure that it has made the car run smoother or quieter but, but there has been no adverse effects and my MPG has gone from an average of 38.6 to 40.5. So even given any inaccuracy re the on board computer (which has been the subject of other threads on here) fuel economy seems to be a definite benefit!

The diagnostic equipment i have allows me to read lots of live data.

I ran my wife's TDCI up hot and was reading injector rail pressure and injector fuel adjustment percentages then added 2 stroke to the tank whilst running.

In 20 mins the fuel pressure never varied or the correction percentages telling me that the oil did not increase fuel pressure, but also need to bear in mind that the fuel rail pressure is regulated.

The MPG improved around 3-4mpg and its so much quieter and smooth.

Haven't done the FR2 as don't want to give LR any excuse to bail out of any issues.

Hi guys

haven't dropped in here for a while.

I see you guys are still debating in circles re: the 2sO addition to diesel. Had a good chuckle reading some of the more recent comments.

Well on the Disco3 forum the penny has dropped regarding the 2sO addition.

Had a long chat to one of the leading pump shop specialists in Johannesburg, discussing the eternal 2sO issue. He started laughing and had a good chuckle, when I told him what is being discussed on some of the continental LR and Merc forums.

His comments to me where, "you are absolutely right but I cannot propagate this, as it would severely restrict my work intake." But his next comment was priceless "Sure I use it on all my vehicles for many years already".

For those of you who want their systems to last: Use Jaso-FC compliant 2sO in a ratio of 1:200, i.e. 500ml of 2sO per 100 litres of diesel.

One of the best comments more recently in this thread was the one that questioned the viscosity change of diesel in regards to a possibility of negatively impacting on the tribological properites of the diesel. Or to put into plain words, that diesel spiked with 2sO would not be able to pass through the very small orifices of the CRD injectors.

Well I will pop in from time to time here. Those of you who would like more info, can send me a pm.  With kind regards
DiscoGeorge
1998 Disco1 ES 300Tdi with twin TrueTracs
2005 Disco3 TDV6 S
And some more serious stuff

Come back to take a pop at other people have you  ______________________
2011 Full Fat RR 4.4 TDV8
2012 FL2 SD4 Auto HSE
2013 Kawasaki Versys 650

<snip> what a , hopefully hes gone off somewhere to needlessly charge his battery

This post has been edited by the site admin
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"I can't always believe facts I read on the web" - Charles Dickens

winner by default of the tractor vs caravan race

Dave wrote:

Come back to take a pop at other people have you

I'm a member of all of Martin's forums, as my signature would suggest I've been working my way through all that LR make.

Just one for the record. I have a work colleague who has an Audi A4 diesel who has clocked up 288,000 miles in this car without the use of any adatives. That for me is enough proof that adatives aren't required or needed.

If you believe all that you preech then please continue to use that product in your engines/fuel. This is a subject that I have no doubt will be debated for a long time to come.

As a moderator all I ask is that you don't critisize/flame/insult or abuse others comments because they don't agree with what you say. Posts can/will be modified or deleted. That statement applies equally to everyone. ______________________
2011 Full Fat RR 4.4 TDV8
2012 FL2 SD4 Auto HSE
2013 Kawasaki Versys 650

Here are some pictures and comments from a long time 2-stroke oil user in the US of his engine internals. It's pretty impressive.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=3876027&postcount=26

Good to see you still around DiscoGeorge.

Hi kaanage

well that is what it is all about with this 2sO story. And here we only emphasize the auxiliary benefits over and above the increase in lubricity!

The bottom line is actually quite simple:

1. It works

2. It saves money and downtime

3. On average lifespan of diesel components is extended by a factor 2 - 2.5 at least


And here some pics of the glow plugs that came out of my 300Tdi after some 250000km (they were burnt out).

Especially check how clean the shafts are. Normally they are full of carbon deposits and goo.

The glow plug on the extreme left is a brand new one, before fitting.

Click image to enlarge

Click image to enlarge

Admin note: this post has had its images recovered from a money grabbing photo hosting site and reinstated

Some facts, thanks to Toadshall:
https://www.freel2.com/gallery/albums/user...1-0848.pdf

Despite the fact that the paper doesn't point exactly to a specific additive, it still says:
Specific lubricity additives with carboxylic acid-, ester- and amide based chemistries can increase the lubricity in a variety of base fuels at a concentration of 200 ppm to meet the lubricity requirement according to EN590.

Interesting that, again, it says that biodiesel, in concentrations of 5% or more, is quite enough for satisfying lubricity issues.

They've also talk, besides High-Frequency Reciprocating Rig (HFRR), about the High-Temperature Oscillating Machine (HiTOM).

The HiTOM (High-Temperature Oscillating Machine) has been designed by BOSCH to reproduce in a controlled environment the main contacts that are present in the drive of Common Rail pumps. The machine kinetics of the chosen machine element are tribological similar to the real conditions experienced in the high-pressure pump.

And a MAJOR thing, to say at least, at conclusions:

Therefore, the removal of sulphurised compounds is not the major reason for the loss of lubrication of ultra low sulphur diesel fuels.

Then, who is the culprit?....