given that the TD4e has


"A new Polyetheretherketone friction control plate has been developed for the Freelander TD4_e. This is able to withstand seven times the pressure of the outgoing plate"



does that mean it should have fewer issues ?
source : http://www.green-car-guide.com/land-rover-...t.html[/i] 

Not had any issues so far with her Ladyship's DMF: TD4-e MY2010 +45k kms

pcheaven wrote:

given that the TD4e has


"A new Polyetheretherketone friction control plate has been developed for the Freelander TD4_e. This is able to withstand seven times the pressure of the outgoing plate"



does that mean it should have fewer issues ?
source : http://www.green-car-guide.com/land-rover-...t.html[/i]

The ‘seven times’ claim was being made at the time of introduction, middle 2009 so no it does not make it better.

DON’T buy a manual unless you are prepared for the gamble A Land Rover owner since 1988

From a 1974 series III to a 12MY XS FL2 with help of a 1995 D1, 1996 D1, 2005 D3, 2007 D3 and a 2009 FL2.

gstd4-e wrote:

DON’T buy a manual unless you are prepared for the gamble

A minuscule number of failures against sales, hardly a gamble

taztastic wrote:

gstd4-e wrote:

DON’T buy a manual unless you are prepared for the gamble

A minuscule number of failures against sales, hardly a gamble

I would dispute the thought that DMF issues are not that common, plenty of threads on other manufacturers owner sites for their failure. Seems to be typically between 50-100 thousand miles and Fords attitude is that the DMF is on a par with the clutch plate itself i.e. a consumable.

Clutch slip itself should be no more an issue with DMF versus standard flywheels as it has to work the same way although I wonder if as a result of the implementation of the DMF the specification of the clutch has been reduced. A number of reports of DMF failure include unusual noises and vibration ultimately due to problems with the springs and the thrust bearing between the flywheel plates. In some cases the garages replacing the clutch have recommended replacing the DMF as a matter of course because of their limited life. These replacements include the option of switching to a solid flywheel although not within the dealer network.

I know why the DMF was introduced, it just seems to be something the marketing men wanted rather than a real need and is rather dubious progress. Prog rock is cool!
2012 XS SD4 Indus Silver

DMF is a big problem. Even the new Defender is suffering.
The fitting of a solid flywheel is not always an option as it can sheer the crank.
A friend of mine has a Nissan Navara and his DMF fell apart and came though the casing. All fixed under warranty with a solid flywheel, but a solid flywheel is not an option with the PSA crankshaft.
But it seemed that Nissan has accepted that DMF is a PITA.

i know several owners of vehicles with DMF's and i'm shocked at the incidence of clutch slip, these include Pug, Citroen, Ford, Kia and L/R but to name a few.
I did post a poll on this forum and although I accept it may not reflect a Nationwide percentage, the number of failures were shocking.
One failure is one too many by any standards. They are getting away with it once the vehicle is out of warranty and sometimes even when the vehicle is under warranty, ie if you've got a tow bar.

It's not fit for the purpose for which it's intended and as such owners shouldn't have to pay a penny to have it fixed.
Unfortunately, the real World is very different.
If mine fails again and they won't fix it out of warranty, then it's off to court.
I've the evidence, they just excuses.

Sorry, rant over. Another member of the failed FL2 clutch/DMF club, twice.

I empathises with the comments that have been made, however, my own position on this subject is that both the clutch and the DMF are consumables. Having taken that position, the next phase of establishing ownership "well being" is to establish what do I accept as a satisfactory reasonable component life i.e. durability.

Mona Geezer reports 50k miles (80k kms) and at that, or even more kilometres, I'd be content in these mountains with such a durability. Anything less would be a component failure. Manufactured items do not last forever, but with proper maintenance, regular servicing and a prudent driving style they are usually fit for purpose and deliver a satisfactory performance.

Ditto what Pegleg said.

Not what Ben Willie said.

Forums are about information and having used and contributed information and donations to Disco3 and FL2 since 2005 I think it is absolutely right to identify issues to owners and prospectivie owners.

Perhaps Mr Willie should do a bit of research before engaging keyboard

FL2  A Land Rover owner since 1988

From a 1974 series III to a 12MY XS FL2 with help of a 1995 D1, 1996 D1, 2005 D3, 2007 D3 and a 2009 FL2.

gstd4-e wrote:

Perhaps Mr Willie should do a bit of research before engaging keyboard

Forums are about the exchange of ideas, points-of-view, information, trivia and facts. I'm an advocate for open reporting and transparency, and against censorship or to censure.

If a member does not agree with another's point-of-view, or rejects an idea, or is disinterested in a piece of information then they should raise their own game rather than mire themselves in another's perspective, so that the discourse may progress.

And, if something is presented as a fact and is not, then we all can be certain that someone (or more) within the Freel2 community will expose the falsehood faster than anyone can pronounce DMF

How much does a new DMF cost to fit, not at LR dealers but at independents. I assume most people got to LR independents once their warranty is over.

For what its worth Ive just bought my 5th Freelander. All have been extremely reliable really. The 1st (K series diesel) had a new IRD unit under warranty, 2nd and 3rd had no issues at all. The 4th (FL2) had a stiff gearchange sorted and twice had the reverse lockout solenoid fail in the first year. It was sold after 5 years with nearly 50K miles and I got 50% of what i paid for it new. We never had any DMF issues.

The only DMF Ive ever had replaced was on our Fabia VRS but that was at 70K miles and it was modded.

athelstan wrote:

community will expose the falsehood faster than anyone can pronounce DMF

Damaged My Fingers  Another member of the failed FL2 clutch/DMF club, twice.

Jules,
Can't help you there sorry. Mine was fixed under warranty, i would have thought at a dealer around a grand or so unless L/R agree a %age donation. Another member of the failed FL2 clutch/DMF club, twice.

Always good to see an arguement develop.

I have not researched this issue of clutch DMF failures and neither has anyone else on this forum. A poll has no statisical validity. My experience is based on my opinion and that is based on three friends who own manual FL2s who have, so far, had no issues whatsoever. Furthermore, my last four cars have been diesels, 2 manuals, with clutch DMF combos and two autos. I had one problem with an auto but no problems with the manuals despite doing over 90,000 miles in each. My driving was essentially non-motorway, but also non-towing. All cars are made from consumable parts, it's just a case of how quickly you consume them or how unlucky you are if they are in some way defective. To suffer a major failure is dreadful for the individual and causes a great loss of confidence in the brand, but it does not constitute a major design issue for the manufacturer unless proven. I have not yet experienced a court case where emotion, no matter how deeply felt, has prevailed. It may well be the case that the FL2 has a DMF problem, but LR will undoubtedly have statistics that show the Mean Time Between Failure (MTBF) for the clutch DMF is within design parameters and with over 4000 members of this forum and what amounts to a numericaly small number of failures (not a percentage of those polled) then a successful action against LR is unlikely to be successfull.

My thoughts, no prejudice.