I suspect that the push for replacement of the ICE fleet will come from CO2 and NOX emissions. Producing biodiesel from plants might solve the CO2 argument but at the expense of massive amounts of agricultural land turned over to biofuels and construction of suitable processing facilities. However, assuming that we did produce 100% "green" fuels the NOX argument remains and will I believe be the killer for diesel certainly and I can see the policy levers available to the government eg raise fuel duty and ban diesels (and then petrol) from urban areas.
I suspect that in 9 years time we will find that it becomes increasingly difficult and expensive to run an old ICE car and that only enthusiasts with classic cars will eventually remain. The car industry is approaching its "Kodak" moment. 3 x FL1 2 manual + 1 auto
5 x FL2 4 manual + 1 auto
Now Discovery Sport P250 MHEV SE

Is CO2 such a problem anyway ?
I dont think it is such a problem compared to the millions of tonnes of plastic waste being dumped every year (that will be around for many generations and enter our food chain with all sorts of potential issues like genetic changes etc).
CO2 is non-toxic in small doses (anaesthetists used to administer it) and can be removed by simply planting more photosynthesising plants. Jules

PRadd wrote:

BEV?

"Is CO2 such a problem?" In my mind (as an ex scientist) that's still debatable although any debate on the matter is stifled by claims of Climate Denial so the climate bandwagon is now unstoppable and is the driving force. 3 x FL1 2 manual + 1 auto
5 x FL2 4 manual + 1 auto
Now Discovery Sport P250 MHEV SE

Seems us heretics are to be burned at the stake - producing more CO2 in the process Jules

We’d come and watch that but aren’t allowed out to social gatherings just yet

We won't see any dramatic changes in our life time, nor will the next generation. There is just too much change needed in such a short time span. Public transport, The Haulage and delivery industry for a start. then there are cars, Range is rubbish still, most can't tow, a huge amount of the population will have nowhere to charge their cars because of where they live. the list goes on.

It will happen in the future, no doubt, but not for many years.

Got to go, I have left my old V8 Stag idling outside Greta's house  2007 TD4 XS The work horse that earns its up keep
2013 SD4 HSE The posh one for towing the caravan
1973 Triumph Stag I bought in 2009 and restored.

At 76, approachign77, my wonderful 2011 SD4 HSE will have to outlast me. She, she is definitely female, has just today gone to get belts and fluids changed, and MOT. I had to hire a car as a replacement (covid restrictions) and the guy setting up the hire could not believe she was so "old". She will survive!!! I will keep her for as long as I can.

dorsetfreelander wrote:

"Is CO2 such a problem?" In my mind (as an ex scientist) that's still debatable although any debate on the matter is stifled by claims of Climate Denial so the climate bandwagon is now unstoppable and is the driving force.

Just a thought, I seem to remember when we bought our FL2, LR were into carbon offsetting so they "guaranteed" that the car was carbon neutral for manufacture and the first 30k. Wonder how that compares to a new electric vehicle?

Hopefully the DS will see me out, so I will never have to suffer driving a posh milk float - nowhere to charge it and I can't imagine one dragging a 1,500kg caravan to Spain / France and back without wasting a lot of the holiday waiting for the battery to charge. Tangiers Orange - gone, missing her
Replaced by Ewok what a mistake - now a happy Disco Sport owner

I would like to convert my Freel2, or maybe a newer one to electric drive.
I know someone doing this very thing to a Freelander 1 at the moment, I actually made the motor drive coupling for it. It's using a combination of parts from a scrapped Nissan Leaf (motor, batteries, and power-electronics), driving the original FL1 gearbox and AWD system.
It'll work too, and seems to retain 80% of the internal space for passengers and luggage. The only couple of drawbacks are limited range, although that could be partially addressed, and slow charging of the battery, due to limitations in the original Leaf design. Thankfully the old FL1 is electronically backwards compared to the Freel2, which makes it easier to integrate the Leaf stuff with the LR stuff.

This integration issue will be more complex with the Freel2, but I'm sure it's solvable, and being a large vehicle, it'll have more space for batteries.
As the price of the Freel2 drops, it'll become a tempting proposition to convert it to electric drive.  Hyundai Ioniq 5 Ultimate. The family car.
2009 Rimini Red SE TD4. Gone.
2006 Tonga Green i6 HSE. Gone.
Audi A5 convertible, my daily driver.
1972 Hillman Avenger GT, the project.

Why?
I know the answer, because you can.
Seriously why, by the time you have bought the motor, speed controller, batteries, charger and spent 100's of hours on the conversion you will have a car that is less capable, difficult to insure, less range - and the cost of the conversion would have bought enough diesel to get the FL2 to the moon and back.

Don't get me wrong I understand the "because I can", 20 years ago I replaced the old diesel engine in a canal barge, with a drive motor from a forklift, speed controller from a forklift and dropped the battery cells into saddle tanks to even out the weight. Got it slightly wrong, maybe a 35kW motor for a barge was a bit big, but at least she could stop on a sixpence, batteries - needed charging every 2-3 weeks on a barge used daily for trippers, and the silence was appreciated. The lack of heating from the engine was missed, but that could have been sorted if the owner had wanted to. Tangiers Orange - gone, missing her
Replaced by Ewok what a mistake - now a happy Disco Sport owner

Andy131 wrote:

Why?
I know the answer, because you can.
Seriously why, by the time you have bought the motor, speed controller, batteries, charger and spent 100's of hours on the conversion you will have a car that is less capable, difficult to insure, less range - and the cost of the conversion would have bought enough diesel to get the FL2 to the moon and back.

Don't get me wrong I understand the "because I can", 20 years ago I replaced the old diesel engine in a canal barge, with a drive motor from a forklift, speed controller from a forklift and dropped the battery cells into saddle tanks to even out the weight. Got it slightly wrong, maybe a 35kW motor for a barge was a bit big, but at least she could stop on a sixpence, batteries - needed charging every 2-3 weeks on a barge used daily for trippers, and the silence was appreciated. The lack of heating from the engine was missed, but that could have been sorted if the owner had wanted to.

If I was to convert an Freel2 to electric, I'd use a salvaged Leaf to provide me with the parts. Cost wise, I could have a working Freel2 for under £10k, with a 120 miles range, and just as practical as it is now. If you like a car, and want to be able to drive it in the future, then I can see the appeal of doing the conversion.
At the moment, there's nothing electric that is as good as the Freelander, so I may have no choice.  Hyundai Ioniq 5 Ultimate. The family car.
2009 Rimini Red SE TD4. Gone.
2006 Tonga Green i6 HSE. Gone.
Audi A5 convertible, my daily driver.
1972 Hillman Avenger GT, the project.

jules wrote:

Is CO2 such a problem anyway ?
I dont think it is such a problem compared to the millions of tonnes of plastic waste being dumped every year (that will be around for many generations and enter our food chain with all sorts of potential issues like genetic changes etc).
CO2 is non-toxic in small doses (anaesthetists used to administer it) and can be removed by simply planting more photosynthesising plants.

This is what we should be using in our Diesel burning vehicles; https://www.shropshirelive.com/business/20...hropshire/
The SulNox technology has been around for many years, but as far as I can see, the big fuel producers don't want anything to do with it as it will reduce their profits.
If only some enterprising person would sell this fuel commercially, then I'm sure there would be 'queues around the block' to fill up tanks! -------------------------------------------------------------
1965 Series IIa Safari LWB White - gone
1982 RR 2 door Sahara dust - gone
2000 Freelander 1 3 door white gold - gone
1995 Discovery 1 200Tdi Biaritz Blue - gone
2009 FL2 TD4 HSE Stornoway Grey