Thanks.
As usual, it's just about biting the bullet and giving it a go. I know that some people add kerosene to the diesel in their cars to clean out the fuel injection system. People don't mind putting in redex, millers, Forte etc. so why not 2SO? I'll try it I think, as the benefits to the HP pump, injectors, and top end can't be ignored. Better than biofuel additives methinks.

I'm thinking of giving this a go - does anybody have any views on semi-synthetic or full synthetic TSO for an engine fitted with a DPF?

Synthetic or part synthetic is not the issue, JASO FB for non DPF and JASO FC for DPF specification is what to look for, JASO FC has a lower ash spec more suited for DPF vehicles and unfortunately its dearer.

I picked up a couple of 1 litre bottles of 2T FC from Asda (had to order on the website and pick up at the local store) cost me £5.00 each instead of the in-store price of £7.50

Store told me they wouldn't price match with their own website

I can put the money saved towards buying some chicken for dinner  2002 Honda VFR800
2002 Toyota Celica 140 Silver (mid life crisis - again!)
2007 FL2 GS Manual Army Reconnaissance Green + freel2.com sticker
2004 Toyota Celica 140 Black - Gone
2000 Toyota Celica 140 Silver - Gone
1998 Toyota Celica ST Pearl Green - Gone
1996 Nissan Primera 1.6 - Gone
1994 Rover Montego 1.6 Auto - Gone

Can you confirm it was FC spec and not FB. I went into my local ASDA last night and they had their own brand TSO oil on the shelf (at £5 per lt) but it was FB, so given other comments on here I didn't buy it.

IanH wrote:

Can you confirm it was FC spec and not FB. I went into my local ASDA last night and they had their own brand TSO oil on the shelf (at £5 per lt) but it was FB, so given other comments on here I didn't buy it.

This is what I bought

http://direct.asda.com/Castrol-Motorcycle-...lt,pd.html

Asda shelf price was £7.50 - Only seems to be in the 'larger' stores though!!!!

previously been buying from Half&rds at more like £10 a litre 2002 Honda VFR800
2002 Toyota Celica 140 Silver (mid life crisis - again!)
2007 FL2 GS Manual Army Reconnaissance Green + freel2.com sticker
2004 Toyota Celica 140 Black - Gone
2000 Toyota Celica 140 Silver - Gone
1998 Toyota Celica ST Pearl Green - Gone
1996 Nissan Primera 1.6 - Gone
1994 Rover Montego 1.6 Auto - Gone

I though you were maybe referring to this one

http://groceries.asda.com/asda-estore/sear...estid=5785

Last edited by IanH on 18th May 2012 10:43 am. Edited 1 time in total

This is the same (Castrol) TSO I eventually picked up in Halfords - trouble was I paid £8.99!

Have a chat with one of our Sponsers 'Opie Oils' http://www.opieoils.co.uk/c-1274-jaso-fc.aspx
They have some reduced prices at times

Well I spent all day yesterday reading this very interesting debate on 2so (2 Stroke Oil) when I should have been doing so much more, fortunately the wife was at work!

A complete novice although I have studied oil as I also have had an interest in motorcycles and motorcycle racing for some years, a high performance engine without good oil won’t last. A couple of things sprung to mind when reviewing the posts, we know that 2so lubricates because it’s been used for this very purpose for probably over 100 years in 2 stroke petrol engines, we know it works because if it’s not used the engine will seize.

There are also diesel versions of the 2 stroke engine which have also been in existence for over 100 years but these are not lubricated via a diesel oil mix but are lubricated via conventional 4 stroke method so the lubricating qualities of 2so in diesel must have been looked at, at some time in the past?

What I also know is that perfectly good diesel engines have been failing due to a lack of lubrication in cylinders; I know this because I have been studying the used car market for the last 9 months and you would be surprised at how many Range Rovers I’ve seen for sale requiring new engines or problems with compression in a cylinder, the evidence is out there. This also happened to a friend of mine in his BMW Td4 Freelander requiring a new engine so something is going wrong, something that didn’t affect earlier engines because I have run 3 diesel engine cars up to high mileage without any problems what so ever.

There are two major things that I can see that have changed recently for diesel engine cars, firstly as we know the sulphur has been reduced, oil companies have change the overall chemical composition of the fuel because of environmental pressure and this can affect fuel pump seals, engine seals, and 'O' rings, some of which react to changes in fuel composition by swelling or shrinking. This problem can be fixed by replacing the seals with ones made from newer, less susceptible, materials but the problem still exists that diesel fuel has less lubricating additives now than it did have some years ago. Petrol in 2 stroke engines had this problem so oil was added to the fuel, bio diesel has been added to standard diesel it has good lubricating properties but is hydroscopic maybe this is where the problem lies? I will be adding 2so to my fuel in future, the levels mentioned on here are very low and maybe this could help dissipate the hydroscopic propertied of the biodiesel as well as offer some additional lubrication?

The second major issue that I can see that has changed is the grade of engine oil now specified for diesel engines, old diesel engines where spec’d with heavy grade oils mainly 20W 40’s in the UK but in recent years the base oil has got thinner and thinner and we are now seeing 0w30 oils spec’d. Whilst oil technology is light years ahead of where it was a ‘0’ grade oil is mighty thin, think of something that you would lubricate a sewing machine with and a compression combustion engine still creates a massive amount of force when combustion takes place.

All of this in the name of economy, lighter oils less drag more fuel efficiency so I was surprised to see Yamaha fan suggest a 0w40 spec oil, this has a base stock of a ‘0’ grade oil that is modified to give it the 40 spec, the wider the gap between the numbers the more the oil has been modified, not that it matters that much these day with the high quality of synthetic oil but as oil breaks down it is constantly trying to get back to its original form. The smaller the gap between the grade the less it has been modified therefore the 5w30 that Land Rover/PSA specify has a slightly thicker base stock than the 0w40 that Yamaha fan recommended. I would stick with the grade that LR/PSA specifies but I would question why LR/Ford is spec’ing the type of oil they are spec’ing?

If we look at Mobil, generally regarded as the best oil manufacture in the world, with Shell a close second, why? Because they have the biggest amount of money to spend on oil development, I wouldn’t use anything else. LD/Ford specify Wss-M2C913-B this equates to Mobil Super 3000 X1 but PSA specify B71 2290 & B71 2297 this equates to Mobil 1. Now Mobil will freely tell you that Mobil 1 is there leading cutting edge oil and that it out performs Mobil Super 3000 so why is LD/Ford spec’ing it in the same engine that PSA spec Mobil 1? I know what I’ll be using.

Just a foot note to this, vehicle manufacture spend an awfully long time and allot of money testing their engines in different environments to come up with the specifications they recommend, I would suggest that any decision to move away from what is recommended by a manufacture is done after very careful consideration.

I would like to see the VW/Mercedes extreme environmental recommendations for 2so that is published in their extreme environment handbooks, that can’t be in anyway against any legal precedence if it’s been published? It’s not going to stop me from using 2so but it would be great to see it actually acknowledged by a manufacture somewhere.

I would like to know the basis of Yamaha Fan’s recommendation for the grade of oil you suggest.

I would also like to thank her for raising this very interesting debate in the first place.

Have been reading this one with interest. We started adding Morey's UCL to our tractors maybe 30 years ago, off and on. At present, am using an Australian product, cannot recall name as it was old stock/surplus/disposal and was in plain packs. $5:00 a gallon ! It works really well. We bought a used tractor, about 2500 hrs run and the exhaust at idle was a bluey haze. Now with a couple of years work, the exhaust is clear at idle. The injectors are untouched. What I think happens is this. This particular oil has a high flash/burn point. As it is slowily consumed by the engine it is absorbed into soot at the business end of the injector, absorbed into deposits in the engine, softening, flaking and cleaning. The injectors I suspect are in pristine order, we are getting ideal atomisation, a good burn, extracting maximum value from the fuel. I think that there is little downside. The amounts going in are miniscule in reality. The worst that can happen is nothing. At the very least it makes me feel happy. But the clean exhaust, snappy response, I can happily live with. I have read that in petrol engines, greater wear could be measured near inlet valve where petrol enriched vapour dissolved protective oil on the bore. So having a continuing dose of oil, albeit small, must be a plus. Once my supply, 30 gallons runs out, I will have little qualms about a good shot of super two stroke every fill. One final point, the exhaust smells dry, well burnt, not aromatic and oily, if that makes sense.

In regards to concerns about clogging the DPF, the industry standard for maximum ash content in TC-W3 oils is 0.001% or 10ppm(US). A specific brand has claims 0.000% ash or truly ashless. For comparison EN 590 ULSD requires a maximum ash content of 0.010% or 100ppm, this is also the same standard for US ULSD. In addition 507.00 rated engine oils call for a maximum ash content of 0.80% or 8000ppm.

So in conclusion it is known that ash is what clogs a DPF. But, due to the claimed 0.000% Ash content it is impossible for TC-W3 to contribute to ash accumulation. If the oil contained the maximum 0.001% it would still be so negligible that you would not relize a reduced lifespan of DPF... To put it in blatant terms you would have to burn 10 more gallons of 2T oil for every 1 gallon of Diesel just to catch up to ULSD's ash content. 100gal 2T = 10gal ULSD ash (assuming 2T=0.001% worse case scenario). You could almost say Diesel is more harmful than the oil.

So I am calling this one BUSTED. TC-W3 is in fact DPF safe (and 2007+ safe. Heck, I have been running it in my 2012 CR TDI since day 1)

PS: I have all the evidence if anyone wants it. I just don't know if i can post any brands on here.

Thanks for reading and I hope this clears up some confusion.

Tesco selling a litre of Castrol Actevo 2T for just over a fiver. JASO FC. Think this is a mineral based oil so good quality? HSE, td4 - Stornoway Grey - full alpaca interior - 2011 front facelift - privacy glass.
Just added side steps, replaced the yellow side lights & body coloured handle and wing mirror covers. Now for the spoiler!

Yep, thats the stuff I'm using (and my cousin is also using in his Disco 3 V6)

Whow, what a thread! Took me days to read all the posts.
In general, Yamaha-Fan has put her finger in the right spot and all she said is correct and in line with the present knowledge and experence.
But one thing I have to add:
All Euro 5 certified diesel engines -and this will NOT affect any Euro 4 or lower diesel-engines- should reduce
the dosis of 2SO from 1:200 to 1: 150 or 1:100, depending on the engine-manufacturer, as the Euro 5-engines are very prone to sulphur even in its lowest contents. So when you choose your 2SO please check the sulphor content of the product of your choice. The product Addinol MZ 406 is recommended by the University of Rostock
in its end of 2011 study on this subject.