FREEL2,

What Torque do you use





I do use a Torque Wrench and I set it to

25 Nm

And it never leaks

Is the + 5 an upper limit

25 to 30 Nm

Or does it mean something else


I am just curious if I’ve been doing it wrong

Thanks

Paul

Never torqued an oil filter cap in my life and I’ve been in the trade 45+ years. Just nip it up. Past: FL2 TD4 HSE Auto
Evoque SD4 Dynamic Lux Auto
Present: Audi A3 S Line.

I tighten it until the cap lip seats on the canister, the oring makes it fairly firm to turn but it comes to a hard stop when it seats.

It would probably seal fine at some intermediate point, but who knows where that point it is... the seat is definitive.

It's not NPT or a bolt that's getting tension so I don't really see the torque rising much until it actually seats. I assume that's what the torque value is for... but it's also obvious when it stops turning.

The filter cover is sealed by an O ring, which is on the side, just above the threads. This means that the cover will actually seal, even if the cap is only hand tight, or even a few turns off tight.
The 25 Nm torque is listed, simply to stop over zealous spanner monkeys from breaking the thing, by over-tightening the cap.
If the technician knows what they are doing, there's no need to use a torque wrench, and on some vehicles (the TD4 for instance) a torque wrench won't get anywhere near the cap. Hyundai Ioniq 5 Ultimate. The family car.
2009 Rimini Red SE TD4. Gone.
2006 Tonga Green i6 HSE. Gone.
Audi A5 convertible, my daily driver.
1972 Hillman Avenger GT, the project.

Yes, I have been known to exhibit "spanner monkey" characteristics on occasion.

Excellent feedback by everyone

I will continue to use the Torque wrench just to make sure that I don't get too aggressive with the torque.

I did snap a bolt recently (M5 or M4) on a Transmission filter when I over Torqued it. (My Son's VW with a 6 speed AISIN that is very similar to the one in my LR2, except that it has an accessible filter)

To remedy the situation I backed out the broken bit with some needle nose pliers. So no harm done.


I do agree that the Oil filter housing gasket is a "Soft Joint" and that it has a lot of compliance and it is easy to install and if I did it more than once every six months then I would likely just make it hand tight. When Oil filters were small metal cans I always installed by hand.

Take care

Paul

Last edited by p_gill on 22nd Jun 2021 3:41 pm. Edited 1 time in total

My oil & filter is due soon, I'll use a torque wrench and see how much it needs to get it to the seat.

You always seem to need loads more torque to get the thing undone. I just do it "hand tight" Jules

Confirmed, the 25 n*m torque value is a safety stop.

As I tightened it, it stayed around 10-15 n*m until it seated on the housing, and only then did it sharply rise to 25+.

So if you seat the cap and no further, you're good. It's easy to feel when you get there.

Perfect

I use the Torque wrench

But in the future if its not handy I will install as directed

I appreciate the detail

Take care

Paul

Coming a little late to this thread (only 12 years), but I think relevant. Probably very obvious to more experienced among you, but there may be members who this hadn't occured to (like me!)...

Did annual oil filter and oil change last weekend (2012 Freelander 2, TD4).

Filter housing always worryingly difficult to unscrew. I think this must be due to swellig of O-ring with heat /oil?? Anyway, got it free , replaced cartridge and replaced housing without drama.

As the housing was Sooooo difficult to unscrew, I cleaned the thread and seating even more carefull than usual, made sure the new O-ring was correctly seated , and just nipped down the housing by hand (new O-ring as always). Access is almost impossible (why would you hide THE most frequent service items there ?!) and I have big hands to get into the limited space, so may not have got much traction. It wwent on quite easily for first few turns and clearly not cross threaded.

Once "nipped" and no further movement by hand, the housing was proud of the engine seating by about 2-3mm. To be more precise, there are 3 flanges around the circumference of the housing between the tread and te dome. Te O-ring sits between the 2 flanges nearest the engine. Just hand-tightened, I could JUST see the 2nd (middle) flange sitting in the metal rim of the engine seat, so O-ring only just inside the metal seating.

You won't be surprised to hear that on firing up after refilling, there was a slight leak from around the filter housing. Although tis leak was slight, it was associated with an intermitttent glowig of the ol pressure warning light on dashboard. This was fairly consistent at low revs / idling and less os when revved.

I got the spanner out and tightened the housing until the outermost flange was about to touch the metal seat. It was REALLY tight, but consistently so (not getting any more resistance with each turn), so I carried on, already worrying about how I was going to get it off next time, and whether I was going to damage the housing nut which is after all only plastic. I think it was about another 1.5 FULL turns with teh spanner over and above what I could manage by hand.

Both problems (leak and intermittent low oil pressure warning light) cured by tightening the housing more.

Note the housing is still not fully butted up against the metal seating: I think I could have done another 1/4 turn before it bedded down fully. There is NO risk of it gently unwinding before next change- it is so tight.

It seems the oil pressure one-way valve is seated in teh base of the seating and is sprung. I supsect the oil filter cartridge has to bepused up against this valve in the base for the valve to be effective at maintaining oil pressure. If the housing is not sufficiently screwed in, the cartridge within it may not push up against the valve with sufficient force for it to work properly, hence intermittent oil pressure warning light. MAHLE did a press release related to the valve sticking, which is referenced elsewhere in the forums

So, in answer to the comment about does it have to befully bedded down to the metal seat; No, it doesn't, but hand tight is probably not enough, unless you have very string hands and remove stome stuff (e.g. intercooler hose?) to get better access. But certainly if you can still see ANY of the 2nd flange on the housing, you have not tightened enough. Obvious really. Just a shame it's so tight to get off again once tightened down enough.

BTW, I can only get the filter housing off and tightened up again with a swivel head ratcet 27mm ring spanner. How can you get a torque wrench in there? The only ones I've seen are to attach to socket spanners, which I can't see fitting in there, together with the torque wrench head.

25NM sounds very high to me, espec with a plastic (albeit very toug) plastic nut.

Agree re the space available, there's no way a 27mm socket and torque wrench will fit onto my filter housing hence yhe reason for buying the 27mm flex headed ratchet spanner in the first place. Never considered torqueing an oil filter or housing, fitted enough of them over the years to know when they are tight enough. Landrover - turning owners into mechanics since 1948

2014 Orkney grey Freelander SD4 GS.
2004 Zambezi silver Discovery 2 Td5 (Gone)
1963 Surf blue Morris Mini Minor Super de Luxe (my little toy)

Florence wrote:

Coming a little late to this thread (only 12 years), but I think relevant. Probably very obvious to more experienced among you, but there may be members who this hadn't occured to (like me!)...

Did annual oil filter and oil change last weekend (2012 Freelander 2, TD4).

Filter housing always worryingly difficult to unscrew. I think this must be due to swellig of O-ring with heat /oil?? Anyway, got it free , replaced cartridge and replaced housing without drama.

As the housing was Sooooo difficult to unscrew, I cleaned the thread and seating even more carefull than usual, made sure the new O-ring was correctly seated , and just nipped down the housing by hand (new O-ring as always). Access is almost impossible (why would you hide THE most frequent service items there ?!) and I have big hands to get into the limited space, so may not have got much traction. It wwent on quite easily for first few turns and clearly not cross threaded.

Once "nipped" and no further movement by hand, the housing was proud of the engine seating by about 2-3mm. To be more precise, there are 3 flanges around the circumference of the housing between the tread and te dome. Te O-ring sits between the 2 flanges nearest the engine. Just hand-tightened, I could JUST see the 2nd (middle) flange sitting in the metal rim of the engine seat, so O-ring only just inside the metal seating.

You won't be surprised to hear that on firing up after refilling, there was a slight leak from around the filter housing. Although tis leak was slight, it was associated with an intermitttent glowig of the ol pressure warning light on dashboard. This was fairly consistent at low revs / idling and less os when revved.

I got the spanner out and tightened the housing until the outermost flange was about to touch the metal seat. It was REALLY tight, but consistently so (not getting any more resistance with each turn), so I carried on, already worrying about how I was going to get it off next time, and whether I was going to damage the housing nut which is after all only plastic. I think it was about another 1.5 FULL turns with teh spanner over and above what I could manage by hand.

Both problems (leak and intermittent low oil pressure warning light) cured by tightening the housing more.

Note the housing is still not fully butted up against the metal seating: I think I could have done another 1/4 turn before it bedded down fully. There is NO risk of it gently unwinding before next change- it is so tight.

It seems the oil pressure one-way valve is seated in teh base of the seating and is sprung. I supsect the oil filter cartridge has to bepused up against this valve in the base for the valve to be effective at maintaining oil pressure. If the housing is not sufficiently screwed in, the cartridge within it may not push up against the valve with sufficient force for it to work properly, hence intermittent oil pressure warning light. MAHLE did a press release related to the valve sticking, which is referenced elsewhere in the forums

So, in answer to the comment about does it have to befully bedded down to the metal seat; No, it doesn't, but hand tight is probably not enough, unless you have very string hands and remove stome stuff (e.g. intercooler hose?) to get better access. But certainly if you can still see ANY of the 2nd flange on the housing, you have not tightened enough. Obvious really. Just a shame it's so tight to get off again once tightened down enough.

BTW, I can only get the filter housing off and tightened up again with a swivel head ratcet 27mm ring spanner. How can you get a torque wrench in there? The only ones I've seen are to attach to socket spanners, which I can't see fitting in there, together with the torque wrench head.

25NM sounds very high to me, espec with a plastic (albeit very toug) plastic nut.

Ah. My bad. It sounds like same issues re tightening housing though? Is it better access on the I6 ?

The I6 oil filter cap is the same design, just easier to get to, once the PS reservoir is moved aside.
The DW12 diesel filter is low on the block, so quite hard to access. Hyundai Ioniq 5 Ultimate. The family car.
2009 Rimini Red SE TD4. Gone.
2006 Tonga Green i6 HSE. Gone.
Audi A5 convertible, my daily driver.
1972 Hillman Avenger GT, the project.