Before I retired a few years ago l tried to work out what income was needed to maintain a basic standard of living without regular holidays but say still run a car. This was also based on being in a debt free typical home.

So my learned friends what figure would you say today is needed to retire and not be a hermit. My interest is based on a debate I am having with my wife who is having to make some pension choices knowing she may well have to fund many years without any input from me. FL2 MY10 TD4 GS traded in at 2 years
FL2 MY13 TD4 GS Current

I've heard that the average pension requirement to live ok is £21k pa.
But no idea what "ok & average" is and if the £21k is before/after tax. FL2 now gone and have a couple of items left for sale:-

Brodit active iPhone holder + Brodit dash clip,
Bluetooth Music Streaming Module.

I think £21k should be feasible, but aim for the average working wage of £27k to be comfortable. FL2 XS SD4 Auto 2010 2012-2017 (21k - 91k miles) (MY2011)
FL2 Metropolis SD4 Auto 2014 2017- (16k - 77k+ miles) (MY2015)
Metro in its 11th Year of (Extended) LR Warranty / Full LR Service History
(Expensive, but Trouble/Worry free - hopefully?)

I would say it depends on your outgoings, I suggest utilising Mr Micawbers principles.

Personally, we live quite nicely with several 2 or 3 week trips in our caravan and foreign jaunts annually on a modest mid twenties income after tax and are still able to add to our savings pot each month.

Last year we did a hotel in Scotland, a week in north Wales and Derbyshire, 2x3 week trips to Norfolk in the caravan and a couple of weeks in Majorca villa, oh and I replaced the car for a newer one. Going to Disneyland Paris this May for a week.

On the question of single living, won't a portion of any pension you or your wife get be passed to the other if they end up single, I know my wife will get half my current non state pensions when I shuffle off this mortal coil.  MY2014 SD4 XS
Ipanema Sand

MY10 TD4-e GS Manual
Lago Grey Now retired after 8 trouble free years

There is no simple answer Bob . As you already know The only way you can work it out is stick it all on a spreadsheet being honest about what your outgoings and aspirations , and assets are . One person’s modest is another person’s profligate and another person’s poverty .

It’s not a question for a forum .

She needs the services of a good financial planner , won’t be free but amortised over the next 20 years probably the best spend you can make . 2009 GS Auto Zermatt Silver - Sold June 21 after 10 years of ownership

2016 Subaru Outback SE 2.0 diesel SE Premium Lineartronic Sold 2024 after 8 years and 80k miles . Best Car I ever owned !

2023 Toyota Hilux invincible X 2.8 Auto .

I'd suggest £25k joint income would give a comfortable retirement. Can live on less but don't want to be a hermit and there will still be bills on the house etc

It might be interesting to set up an anonymous poll of members' pension incomes. My wife and I have joint pension income of nearly £60k and don't lead a particularly extravagant lifestyle (that's why I drive a FL2 ) so could probably get by on half of that figure. Since the kids left home we have never had so much disposable income. I would steer clear of financial advisors though, at the end of the day they are not in it for your benefit. 3 x FL1 2 manual + 1 auto
5 x FL2 4 manual + 1 auto
Now Discovery Sport P250 MHEV SE

The reason I have put this up is to gauge some views of Mr and Mrs ordinary as any ONS figures about anything are far from the truth.
My wife retires soon and has to decide a level of lump sum to draw down, more in the hand or a larger pension monthly. I think she can draw down the max but she is still deliberating as you would when you are used to a certain level of income.
A proportion of my small pension passes to a spouse but like many I moved around and my personal half pension on death is probably good for some fun events only. It would not keep anyone just on a state pension without their own other income. I drew my max lump sum on retirement over higher pension and I still need to live several years longer to be worse off. My aim is to get there but for sure if I do I am as of this week locked into 28 day hospital visits so I am no longer free to wander off anywhere at anytime.

Yes Martyn a financial planner is a must for many but my Mrs can do her sums. Its a long time since my wife cooked any books for a PLC but she is a Charted Accountant and has done several other roles since qualifying for PLC's.

Accountants do tend to be very risk averse, so no idea why she married me

My own thoughts are on thinking about a single pension (before getting a State pension and no mortgage) is anything over 20K will get you out doing something worthwhile with a car and holidays. We are blessed to have been in the era of final salary pensions. FL2 MY10 TD4 GS traded in at 2 years
FL2 MY13 TD4 GS Current

To fund my life style, I spent £20K-£25K a year.

That includes six (summer) months of travelling each year. That six months is more expensive that the winter months.

I don't pay tax, as I live off an income I made (and paid tax on at that time) over 16yrs ago.

Each to their own.





PS.... Hence I don NOT appear in today's Sunday Times , UK's highest Tax Payers.

.

Last year my daughter changed her job and joined an outfit that used a Scottish Widows pension scheme. Initially she asked if pension payments could be paid into her SIPP but they wouldn't do it so she went along with it. After 10 months the job wasn't going too well and she left and went back to her old employer. I was never happy with the idea of Scottish Widows so started to do some research and found that it was very difficult to find exactly what you money had been invested in and what the charges were so as soon as she left she requested that her Scottish Widows pension be transferred to her SIPP. Her payments in (including tax relief) were about £7.4k but only about £6.7k was transferred out. Even allowing for stock market volatility in 2018 which over the time period was fairly neutral, this is a pretty poor performance. She has written to them complaining but I would encourage anyone in schemes like this to keep a close eye on things, it's too late after 30 years to find you have been overpaying. 3 x FL1 2 manual + 1 auto
5 x FL2 4 manual + 1 auto
Now Discovery Sport P250 MHEV SE

One big factor you have to remember is when you first retire you will need far more money as you will want to travel, hobbies etc.

Yes Jack, I am glad I did for 5 years but often on my own due to a working wife still. But as a couple going abroad we are to be stuffed I suspect as I am now deemed as a high risk.

Maybe Mrs Yorky will be jetting off on her own leaving me at home with the budgie, I had better learn some new tunes to entertain it.  FL2 MY10 TD4 GS traded in at 2 years
FL2 MY13 TD4 GS Current

I would say that if you were grossing around 25K including your state pension, and your partner grossing around 15K including her state pension, ie grossing round about 40k between you, you should be comfortable.

but you still need some savings behind you to draw down on if required to feel comfortable.

unfortunately nowadays the state pension does not kick in until 66 !

Iain

I can clearly see the great divide, how a lot of you can afford £24,000 on a second hand FL2 and why I could only afford a £5000 one.

Technically I feel sure the Govt would class me as living in poverty, my own choice was retiring early at 50 from the Civil Service, I still bear the scars, I managed an early retirement package which gave me 6 grand pension, that was 2005, which I thought was good, never ever really been motivated by greed or money.

Mortgage is paid off, pension now at lofty height of £9,500 a year (some lose that trading cars). Total income is £9,500. Although some say I should milk the system and claim disability because of my arthritis, pride says otherwise.

The hard thing is working out what is the definition of a comfortable life, me and my lady live ok on that amount and we will be rich in 3 years when we both get our retirement pensions.

Neither of us smoke or drink, so that must save us about 12 grand a year compared to many.

We managed in the last 3 years to have varied between either 5 or 4 holiday cottage weeks away in the Yorkshire Dales, which is perfect for us. I have never been ambitious in anyway (as you can tell ) I have no desire whatsoever to go abroad.

I sure don't miss the ratrace, but then again I wont be standing at the end of a bar drinking brandy and smoking a cigar  2017 SEAT Ateca 4drive 2.0 xcellence (May 2022 -
2007 HSE with HST bodykit in Zermatt Silver 169,700 miles (dec 2016 - May 2022 )
2007 Honda Civic Type S GT (2012-2017)
2002 Mini Cooper S (2008-2012)
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1990 Honda Concerto (1999-2003)
1985 Honda Accord (1997-1999)
1983 Honda Accord (1993-1997)
1983 Mini Mayfair (1988-1993)
1974 Mini 1000 (1979-1986)

The Civil Service has many vipers climbing over each other. Not all but many

If you have a right to claim a benefit I would encourage you to do so, even if it only alleviates the cost of prescription charges. The NHS are now going to poor a lot of money into me and with 43 years of stamps paid up I still feel very lucky to be getting such expensive drugs offered but the same drugs are probably at times going to recent arrive-rs who have contributed nothing into our economy so do make your valid claims.

I was brought up in a time of hand me down clothes and feeling hungry as a child and extra money then would have made a big difference but amassing a fortune does not automatically bring always a greater level of happiness. FL2 MY10 TD4 GS traded in at 2 years
FL2 MY13 TD4 GS Current