Yorky Bob wrote:

When that GAP is not reachable how many can afford to make that final payment to be released from that PCP deal.

Yorky Bob wrote:

Quote:

You can walk away at the end of three years and not be tied into buying a similarly expensive car.

I thought most PCP contracts had a final payment that could be as high as 50% of the original value hence most punters rolled that over into a new car on a new contract.

Put me right on this as we have never used a PCP.

That would be finance with a balloon payment. Where PCP works so well is the manufacturer is guaranteeing to take back the car and settle the balloon payment if you don’t want to pay it in order to buy the car outright.

If the car is worth less than the balloon payment (if the bottom were to fall out of the market, for instance), then it’s not the buyer’s problem. If it’s worth more than the balloon payment, then the dealer can offer you that money towards a PX. It’s a Heads you win, Tails they lose situation!

What is really good with the LR scheme is that they are so keen to get people into one (and detached from the idea of buying outright) that they give substantial cash incentives to do so My last new D4 netted £4,000 over and above normal discounts, while the FF was around the same. Free money, always very helpful

Quote:

What is really good with the LR scheme is that they are so keen to get people into one (and detached from the idea of buying outright) that they give substantial cash incentives to do so

Just read the linked article and can't see a huge problem for the owner. First, the article itself is suspect, as it compares the used cars coming onto the market with the current sales of new cars, but doesn't take into account current sales of used cars, so it's not comparing like for like. OK more used cars will come onto the market in the next few years, but if you subtract the number of similar cars coming onto the market at the moment there probably isn't a great difference. Second, the article is suggesting that used prices will drop and the finance companies will take the hit. If that's true, then PCP works in favour of the motorist - the amount of the balloon payment is fixed at the outset, so if the value of the car is less than expected, he can just walk away with a profit.
As the article concludes, it looks like a win-win for the buyer, and a nightmare for the finance companies. Downside is that the companies are owned by the manufacturers, so failure would have a knock-on effect. Ex AA Series III LWB Safari - Gone
300TDi Disco (bought new - terrible car) sent back after 18 months
Freelander 1 Estate - leased, given back at end of lease
200TDi Disco (bought from a mate with 100,000 on the clock) - Gone
Disco 2 TD5 - sold and exported to France
FR2 TD4 GS - Gone
FR2 SD4 HSE - Now changed for a DS
New model ex-demo Evoque S 180 in white
Unable to order a new DS, so gave up. Now have a Volvo S90 Recharge.

Explanations for anything given by car company executives must be regarded as suspect - car industry has history of faulty ethical compass contagion at the top which JLR bosses are not immune from - safety scandals, re-call scandals, emissions scandals - decades of falsehood and mismanagement across many companies.
A fall in sales was almost bound to happen after huge push for volume without building the essentials - right model base, relentless engineering and design inputs, R&D/appropriate innovation and investment in the dealer network.
Marketing twaddle, image/media posturing and such like dross which JLR seem obsessed with do not amount to much if strategic direction is failing to grip the essentials.
A significant proportion of the falling sales across some JLR markets may simply be due to strategic misdirection. All of the model range is distorted by over-pricing and premium brand posturing.
Ewok/DS sales are waining as other companies are producing direct equivalents at significantly lower cost and there is no unique utility model since the Defender died. The mid range models are priced far out of reach of most motorists. The top end Range Rover selling at stratospheric prices is getting mullered by proper premium marques plundering sales with their own super luxury SUVs.
Blaming Brexit and political meddling only goes so far.......

What evidence is there that the Range Rover is “getting mullered by proper premium marques”? And what would you consider those “proper premium marques” to be?

My neighbour who always had a Mercedes was telling me that last year he went into the dealers looking for a approved used replacement. He found a car that he liked and when he asked how much they wanted they only talked in terms of £x/month and wouldn't give him a cash price. He always paid cash in the past so threatened to walk out - which is eventually what happened. 3 x FL1 2 manual + 1 auto
5 x FL2 4 manual + 1 auto
Now Discovery Sport P250 MHEV SE

[quote="Tradewind 35" The top end Range Rover selling at stratospheric prices is getting mullered by proper premium marques plundering sales with their own super luxury SUVs.
Blaming Brexit and political meddling only goes so far.......[/quote]

I think it was the other way round, in that the Range Rover was eating into the sales of the top Luxury Saloons (note I have not used the word Premium, as I believe that it is just a marketing word, and I can appreciate luxury) so these Brands had to FOLLOW and produce their own copies.

And, political meddling and short term removal of profits (instead of long term re-investing) saw the end of many Car Firms in the 1970s and 80s.

The 80s especially wanted to liquidate everything to get at the money.

Even now we seem to value making a quick buck over investing in training and research.

Bring back apprenticeships and recognise engineering as a worthwhile career (it really is!)

PS I speak as fully trained engineer who served a proper apprenticeship with 3 years at a College. FL2 XS SD4 Auto 2010 2012-2017 (21k - 91k miles) (MY2011)
FL2 Metropolis SD4 Auto 2014 2017- (16k - 77k+ miles) (MY2015)
Metro in its 11th Year of (Extended) LR Warranty / Full LR Service History
(Expensive, but Trouble/Worry free - hopefully?)

I don’t think it’s an engineering problem that’s flattening the industry , it’s a marketing problem , selling to “sub prime buyers”. Paying Xhundred and 99 pounds a month is great if the buyer can afford it . I’ve got a relative who works in the county courts, she sees the other side of upsold consumer credit on a daily basis . One day this will come back to bite the motor finance companies in the arse - perhaps the next big mis-selling reclaim 2009 GS Auto Zermatt Silver - Sold June 21 after 10 years of ownership

2016 Subaru Outback SE 2.0 diesel SE Premium Lineartronic Sold 2024 after 8 years and 80k miles . Best Car I ever owned !

2023 Toyota Hilux invincible X 2.8 Auto .

I agree. I have always paid for my vehicles ....OUTRIGHT !!

And yes it could well be the next BIG bubble to burst !

Another Bubble to Burst ...... in the very distant future .......... is the current set of youngsters who are putting money away for their pensions ...... under the governments workplace pension ......"I'm In".

I'm In - will end up meaning I'm In the !


.

I'm In - will end up meaning I'm In the Censored !



You will be if you don't make any provision for your future.  MY 09 GS manual in Lago Grey, Wood Co arm rest and side bumper strips - now sold.

MY 15 SD4 SE Auto Orkney Grey with colour coded Bumper Door Mouldings

but is there a future  FL2 MY10 TD4 GS traded in at 2 years
FL2 MY13 TD4 GS Current

Virtuous that it might sound paying cash, the car industry would grind to a halt overnight if it were to rely on cash purchasers! I also don’t see too much of a difference between wasting money on finance, or wasting it on maintenance At least Finance payments are predictable

There’s no tax relief to be had by spending cash on a car. if you’ve got the cash spare to do that you could easily be better off taking the tax relief by using it to put regular payments into a pension fund instead. But then, I work with finance agreements for a living and I’m probably more comfortable with turning them to my advantage

So that will be the pension funds you put your money in with charges then, I think we have done that one with Endowment mis-selling .  FL2 MY10 TD4 GS traded in at 2 years
FL2 MY13 TD4 GS Current

Last edited by Yorky Bob on 24th Jan 2018 1:27 pm. Edited 1 time in total

Largered wrote:

I agree. I have always paid for my vehicles ....OUTRIGHT !!

And yes it could well be the next BIG bubble to burst !

Another Bubble to Burst ...... in the very distant future .......... is the current set of youngsters who are putting money away for their pensions ...... under the governments workplace pension ......"I'm In".

I'm In - will end up meaning I'm In the !


.

The trick is don’t go out to lease a family hatchback and get sold an Audi RS3 I’m supposed to be helping my lad look for a car. However , apparently I’m an old git who would pick newer low mileage “ POV Spec “ to a budget ,rather than buying with my heart and worrying about cash flow later .  2009 GS Auto Zermatt Silver - Sold June 21 after 10 years of ownership

2016 Subaru Outback SE 2.0 diesel SE Premium Lineartronic Sold 2024 after 8 years and 80k miles . Best Car I ever owned !

2023 Toyota Hilux invincible X 2.8 Auto .