85% of the Kerb Weight of Freelander 2 is 1547 kgs + the wife!  When I die, I want to go peacefully like my Grandfather did, in his sleep -- not screaming, like the passengers in his car

Going back to original question, I towed a Pageant Burgundy regularly with my SE Manual for about 2 years and had no problem whatsoever. Will agree that reversing is not ideal with the manual gearing ratio. I have been towing a slightly heavier Sterling Moonstone for nearly 2 years, which is a bit more than the Caravan Club guide of 85% kerb (!!) weight but find it very maneagable. Experience and common sense count for a lot when towing, plus trailer control systems don't seem to do any harm. However, I will be changing to an auto SD4 next year and blow the drop in economy.
Enjoy the Burgundy, I did and only changed it because Pressurewoman wanted an end bathroom. I was touring round the Cotswolds and up in the Peak District over the last couple of weeks and noticed a few FL2's pulling twin axle vans.

chicken george wrote:

its partly factual that van is too big for a manual fl2, I would have genuine concerns about the clutch

smudger53 wrote:

pab wrote:

Ben Twillie wrote:

What's the official difference in towing weight between the auto and manual?

Only one figure quoted for both in the handbook, so it's the same.

Ben Twillie wrote:

BUT the Auto is better and would pull this van with no problems at all-but so will the manual

Is the auto better? The manual gets a lot of bad press from those with autos, and from those who have had DMF issues, but DMF aside the clutch seems to cope with no problem. And there are several reports of auto boxes going bang! So (and I speak as a manual owner happy with my choice!) I certainly wouldn't dismiss the manual as a good tow car, and it should tow the van you mention with no problems at all.
One thing I would say, though, is that the reverse gear on the manual is too high - significantly higher than first - so try to avoid situations where you have to reverse up hill with the van attached!

Lovely looking van old geezer.And its a twin axle.And i guess its a freelander2 towing it.I was told by a caravan salesman that the freelander 2 was not heavy enough for a twin axle.
Dave

Mav71 wrote:

chicken george wrote:

its partly factual that van is too big for a manual fl2, I would have genuine concerns about the clutch

Complete bull. Sorry CG.

hows the new clutch bedding in Mav (dont get too attached to it , another one will surely follow)


its not complete bull at all, a twin axled van is at the limit of the fl2's towing ability so in my mind too big, big trailers of any kind need big towing vehicles, Expect the unexpected, oil on the road? tyre blow out?, van brake failure? extreme weather? who knows . oversize your towing vehicle its simple road safety At work
At home

"I can't always believe facts I read on the web" - Charles Dickens

winner by default of the tractor vs caravan race

chicken george wrote:

oversize your towing vehicle its simple road safety

I wish I had been able to stop and take a photo of the Police Discovery hanging from the towing eye of its large trailer which had overturned and blocked all three lanes of the M11 a couple of years ago.

chicken george wrote:

Mav71 wrote:

chicken george wrote:

its partly factual that van is too big for a manual fl2, I would have genuine concerns about the clutch

Complete bull. Sorry CG.

hows the new clutch bedding in Mav (dont get too attached to it , another one will surely follow)


its not complete bull at all, a twin axled van is at the limit of the fl2's towing ability so in my mind too big, big trailers of any kind need big towing vehicles, Expect the unexpected, oil on the road? tyre blow out?, van brake failure? extreme weather? who knows . oversize your towing vehicle its simple road safety

The 580/5 is still a single axle van a 120 kgs heavier than is present van, hardly any difference

120kg if you put that in a rucksack and took it for a jog your clutch would soon fail  At work
At home

"I can't always believe facts I read on the web" - Charles Dickens

winner by default of the tractor vs caravan race

Mav
I had my van with all four wheels locked up solid and the abs flat out when two cars collided on a rain soaked auto route when i was doing about 85-90 and the van and car held perfect straight line no problem at all and once the two cars realised I was gaining on them at high speed my word they soon got out the way.

Outfit didn't deviate at all !

chicken george wrote:

Mav71 wrote:

chicken george wrote:

its partly factual that van is too big for a manual fl2, I would have genuine concerns about the clutch

Complete bull. Sorry CG.

hows the new clutch bedding in Mav (dont get too attached to it , another one will surely follow)


its not complete bull at all, a twin axled van is at the limit of the fl2's towing ability so in my mind too big, big trailers of any kind need big towing vehicles, Expect the unexpected, oil on the road? tyre blow out?, van brake failure? extreme weather? who knows . oversize your towing vehicle its simple road safety

oldgeezer wrote:

Mav
I had my van with all four wheels locked up solid and the abs flat out when two cars collided on a rain soaked auto route when i was doing about 85-90 and the van and car held perfect straight line no problem at all and once the two cars realised I was gaining on them at high speed my word they soon got out the way.

Outfit didn't deviate at all !

chicken george wrote:

120kg if you put that in a rucksack and took it for a jog your clutch would soon fail

Are we talking clutch or crotch

Either way you would end up clutching your crotch!  John
07 HSE Narvick Black
Land Rover Series One
Triumph Rocket 111 (sadly gone!)

UKDEN wrote:

oldgeezer wrote:

We got talking and he said for towing with a 4x4 add the two total permitted axle weights and assured me thats what you can tow.

He was wrong. The police often are when it comes to towing matters.

You can tow any mass that does not take your total train weight (weight of car + trailer) above the figure stated on the car "plate". At the same time you must not exceed the stated maximum permissible axle loading. This is relevent, because, with the car loaded its maximum permissible weight, you would possibly exceed the maximum rear axle loading if you have a high nose weight on the trailer (max permitted 150Kg).

For the FL2 the GTW (gross train weight) is 2000Kg more than the GVW (gross vehicle weight).

This means that you can (legally) tow 2000Kg when the FL2 is fully loaded.
You can (legally) tow more than 2000Kg if the FL2 is not fully loaded as long as you do not exceed the GTW stated on the car "plate".

However the fact that it is legal to tow such weights does not necessarilly make it advisable.

Oldgeezer is correct when he says that twin axle vans are (usually) more stable than single axle ones. You should therefore be able to tow a higher weight twin axle van with safety.

To return to my original point.

Does anyone know what the MASS IN SERVICE stated on the V5C means? Is it the unladen weight of the vehicle?
The kerb weight is supposed to be the unladen weight + 75 Kg (for driver).

In response to the question mass in service , I think that is when you have the vehicle fully loaded with people a gear, kerb weight is pretty much empty cept for fuel and driver, then add passengers, dog , suitcases and that figure is your mass in service. My11 freelander 2, xs, Manual, 18" hse sparkles, sidesteps, privacy, zermatt silver metallic, almond nutmeg alacantra, twin electric towbar

Gone my09 xs D3

bambi68 wrote:

In response to the question mass in service , I think that is when you have the vehicle fully loaded with people a gear, kerb weight is pretty much empty cept for fuel and driver, then add passengers, dog , suitcases and that figure is your mass in service.

I think you are wrong on this one.

The weight when the car is fully loaded is 2505 Kg. As stated on the car "plate" and in the V5C under Section 4 (Y) " Revenue weight"

The "Mass in Service" is (only) 1967 Kg.

Still waiting for an answer on this one  Now: 2012 FL2 SD4 XS Orkney Grey
Previously: 2007 D3 TDV6 XS Tonga Green
Before that: 2003 FL1 TD4 "Kalahari" Black