Hi all,
the headliner on my 2006 Freelander 2 without sun roofs, have been sagging and the dpo used some sort of spray glue in an attempt to stick it back on. Of course this was a total disaster, as it kind of made the problem worse. So, next step for him was to take a stampler and shoot 50 staples into the roof liner into the foam on top.
It worked as in keeping the healiner material from hitting his face But looks terrible to say the least, so do not do that.

Now on to today.
I have taken out the head liner.
I have peeled off the original soft material including all staples.
I have kind of rolled off all the old foam which is the real problem, as this dissolved over time.
I have new head liner material ready.
I also have Contact 281 glue ready
I have my spraygun and compressor, mask and ventilation system ready.
I have no problem doing this myself, and I know how to do it.

But, and there is a but:

The problem is, that the dpo's use of spray glue have kind of attacked the surface of the styropor, also known as flamenco (the big roof itself), and made it extremely sticky.

I am kind of reluctant to spray any new glue on to this, as I don't know what will happen chemically nor with the new glue, as in holding on to the styropor roof liner and also the new (quite expensive) headliner material.


The problem is also that I don't know if I can or should clean off this super sticky, tacky surface pollution, or of it can be done at all.

Also, I don't know which chemical to clean it off with if I should do that, to avoid melting the styropor.

Can mineral spirits be used with no ill effect? (I am not going to test, as if it fails, a new from Land Rover is 2500gbp).

Any advice is MOST appreciated.

Kind regards,
Redfox.

Last edited by Redfox on 22nd Apr 2024 8:04 pm. Edited 1 time in total

Anyway, I thought I'll list up the way to do it, as I do it. It's in no particular order, so if you need advice on doing this, read it all twice first. Maybe it can be of help to someone. So here we go in 34 easy steps:

1/ Do not use spray glue. Use contact adhesive and a spraygun and a compressor if you can. Problem is not the lack of compressor and a spraygun, but the glue itself. Sure, spray glue will stick, but for a shorter period. You'll have to redo it. Heat does it's thing over time. And make sure you don't do it in neither very cold nor very hot temperature. And wash your hands 3 times first, before starting any handling of the material to glue on.

2/ Do not cut to edges. Neither the outer edge nor the holes.

3/ Always turn the headliner around so you see the topside (roof side) of it, before trimming anything. This way you can see where to cut and where not to cut.

4/ Trim a 45 degree angle on outer corners. Always leave a bit to fold around edges.

5/ Trim with small cuts near edge on concave lines. Leave a little bit left to fold around edges. Usually an inch or so.

6/ Always leave a bit of material to fold around edges.

7/ When you spray glue, do not spray vertically or near vertically. Flatten the spraying more like horizontal, so the glue flies and land softly. This way it does not wet through. Do not overspray as in using a lot of glue. Just make sure everything gets a layer on both the headliner material and the roof material (the hard foam part).

8/ Do not press with fingers. This compresses the material and the wet glue catches that and you will leave finger marks.

9/ Always use a flat hand and go gentle. Do press a little bit and all over, but make sure you use a flat hand.

10/ Always leave the headliner finished for minimum 24 hours to make sure the glue is dry. If you go install it before, you can very easily make fingermarks as mentioned above.

11/ Spray on both parts. So both the head liner material and the roof hard foam.

12/ Don't let it set before you lay it on. This way, you have a chance to slowly and easily correct any laying down errors you may make. Just lift off and relay that area.

13/ Never stretch any new material anywhere, for example around corners and edges. It makes waves and looks terrible. Always pull towards yourself, don't push material. Do not pull as in putting strength in it. Just do it nice and easy, laying it down. So, stand at the middle and lay the material down with no glue. Then fold back half of it on top of itself, and spray an even layer of glue. Then lay that section down. Back end is best. Then spray the other half and lay that down. Eventually use some sort of card board roll at the middle, to prevent sharp visible edge between the rear half and the front half. Makes it nicer.

14/ Take a photo of the cars headliner before you take it down. And also on the topside to see where cables and hoses may go. Often they are glued in place.

15/ Never ever use spray glue to repair a sagging head liner. It won't help as the foam will just let go directly above the glued area and it sags again.

16/ Never use stables. It looks terrible and you may hit cables and hoses. Also, modern cars often use canbus wiring and you don't want to damage those. Take it down and do it properly. Old material is just lifted away slowly and old foam is removed by a brush or by hand. I do not recommend using a wire brush on a machine. It clogs up and can damage the headliner badly. Be very thorough, so nothing is left of the old material, as it can be seen through despite the new materials foam layer. Using a flat hand is a good way of detecting stuff and bots that you did not see.

17/ Use proper head liner material, as say alcantara with no backing foam or another material can look really bad as there is no leverage from the foam and the glue may wet through. If you do, make a small experiment first on something else.

18/ A rood can be ever so slightly bent over the whole surface, not just an edge, as it will break and you will have to repair that.

19/ Folding all edges will prevent a lot the future sagging, by not allowing any air or other weather depending happenings to slip air and moisture in between the layers of the headliner, so that the foam rottens quicker. Over time though, as in many years, it will happen, but it can be greatly prevented with folding.

20/ Make sure you make contact between the new material with glue, and the hard foam section with glue, so that no area is untouched. Real auto headliner material is multi-way stretchable, so you can adjust and shape it as you glue it on.

21/ Do one half first, say the back or the front. Usually the back is easier with less holes, so you learn as you go and can avoid making mistakes making it look ugly, at the front. S first he rear end half, and then the front end half.

22/ On Freelander 2 (without sun roof) take off the sun visors, the lights, the handles and the hooks. It helps using a wide flat something. I use a 90 degree angle from carpentry.

23/ Working from the front, take down the a-pilars, the b-pilars and the c-pilars. I had to loosen the lower b-pilars to get the upper ones moved.

24/ Take the trunk floor out and lay flat the rear seats.

25/ Take off the rear hatch door loading trim and loosen and remove the two big side trims in the trunk. Remember to remove the two color coded plastic hooks and the 4 metal rings first.

26/ take a few pics of the way the wires is routed before you remove them from the headliner. They are all seriously glued on, so be careful and do not break the headliner. The rear sprinkler hose is not removed. Just locate the front split connector and the rear ditto. No need to destroy the good installation that is already done at the factory. I had to loosen the front end of the hos e a little bit, to get to the connector. Or replace if cracked, of course. That's is why you test it first or at the end before lifting it up and reinstalling the headliner.

27/ Oh, btw. remove the front seat head rests at first, because it will give you a lot of leverage, when you have to take out the headliner from the Freelander 2.

28/ The headliner is taken out via the back door/rear hatch/tailgate. It has to be bent, so as I wrote earlier, do not bend it at a point, it will break. So bend it over the whole line from left to right.

29/ the key locator is velcro'ed to the headliner on top, so remember to unclip that as well, and lay aside. It can be clicked into place after you have taken the headliner out of the car, so you can lock/unlock it, while you work at restoring the headliner.

30/ When everything is taken off, only the door sealings are keeping it in place. Just loosen them and move them down, to give free moving of the headliner.

31/ To take it out of the Freelander 2, lean it over downwards to the right side and lift it at the left side. This is because there's more stuff that it can catch on on the left side, so this is the lifting side. Then bow it carefully, and pull it out slowly, making sure nothing catches and destroys the headliner.
It's only the very rear end of the headliner that catches on everything. As soon as you are past that, it's easy to move out of the Freelander's spacy trunk.

32/ Have a nice cup of tea while preparing the new material, compressor, spraygun and glue.

33/ As I said, let it dry for minimum 24 hours, so no bleeding through and fingermarks can be made.

34/ Installation is just easy and reverse of removal. Use some good hotglue or what ever to fasten the wires and remember the key locator that was velcro'ed in place. Reconnect everything. also the rear sprinkler hose at two points, and test it before lifting it up and securing the whole headliner.

Don't be afraid of doing it, just follow the advices and go gentle. Easy peasy. Have fun.

Kind regards,
Redfox.

Last edited by Redfox on 22nd Apr 2024 9:12 pm. Edited 2 times in total

3M Super 77 spray glue, used it over the decades. Spray both sides, let it dry a bit, then stick together. No second chance. A can goes a very long way.

Lighter fuel for clean-up (clean petrol).

Some photos in this thread above the ceiling: https://www.freel2.com/forum/topic33026.html

If you have the ceiling down while at it stuff it with acoustic insulation, kill two birds with 1 stone! Procrastination, mankind's greatest labour saving device!

Acoustic insulation ARB TPMS 3xARB air compressors After cooler Air tank On-board OCD pressure air/water cleaning Additional 50L fuel Carpet in doors ABE 2x1kg Waeco 28L modified fridge Battery 4x26ah Solar 120w Victron MPPT 100/20 DC-DC 18amps 175amp jumper plug Awning 6x255/60R18

Last edited by Lightwater on 22nd Apr 2024 8:20 pm. Edited 1 time in total

I won't use it. Each to his own of course. But I'd like to ask if you know what to remove the stickyness with, if possible? Okay, so I'll make a test with lighter fuel (clean petrol). I want to avoid dissolving the foam at all costs. I've not had this problem before, as no one used spray glue first. But headliners is no problem. Done that before, also in leather with edge stitching, upholstery etc.
Thanks.
Kind regards,
Redfox.

Have used 3M Super 77 on architectural models for decades. Brilliant stuff. Always have a can on hand. Actually currently 3! Procrastination, mankind's greatest labour saving device!

Acoustic insulation ARB TPMS 3xARB air compressors After cooler Air tank On-board OCD pressure air/water cleaning Additional 50L fuel Carpet in doors ABE 2x1kg Waeco 28L modified fridge Battery 4x26ah Solar 120w Victron MPPT 100/20 DC-DC 18amps 175amp jumper plug Awning 6x255/60R18

I sewed a new ceiling in velvet for my Peugeot 504. It's a lot easier these days to reline (resurface) the original ceiling these days.

Australia: https://www.bunnings.com.au/diggers-1l-shellite-1l_p1563463 Procrastination, mankind's greatest labour saving device!

Acoustic insulation ARB TPMS 3xARB air compressors After cooler Air tank On-board OCD pressure air/water cleaning Additional 50L fuel Carpet in doors ABE 2x1kg Waeco 28L modified fridge Battery 4x26ah Solar 120w Victron MPPT 100/20 DC-DC 18amps 175amp jumper plug Awning 6x255/60R18

I'll get some lighter fuel and some mineral spirit tomorrow, and do some experiments.

Thanks!

Kind regards,
Redfox

Thought I'd mention what glue I use:

Dana lim 281 contact adhesive.
It's stable with really adhesion between -35 - +70 degrees celsius.
Really expensive in small bottles, but cheap in 1 Liter bottle.
It doesn't have to be dissolved with a dab of thinner. No need. If flows from a spraygun just fine. Also, no need for a special or expensive spraygun. Just my old cheap one. No particular nozzle size.
Outside that big window, it's slowly loosing adhesion.
But if you add 5% adhesive promoster called 924, the temperature span will increase to short periods of +120 degrees Celsius, but some have used it to +150 degrees Celsius, with no obvious problems.
That temperature span should be enough, even in a hot car.
Where as 3m 77 spray glue does not stay stable over long periods, at least sometimes. So I don't use it anymore.

Kind regards,
Redfox.

Right, so here's a few pics from the redoing of the headliner on my FL2 i6, 2006.

Old sagging roof liner:



Then the sticky stuff



And the new roof liner I glued on with Dana Lim 281 Contact adhesive by spray gun, plus a brush for the edges, which are all bent around the edge, both outer circumphery and all holes/cut outs, now all done and installed back into the car.



The color is exactly like the original, and the quality is very good from a German specialist supplier, via a local importer. The surface is exactly like the original and it's also got a soft lining on the backside, not only foam. Good stuff. Comes in a long variety of colors btw.

Kind regards,
Redfox.

Very nice. Procrastination, mankind's greatest labour saving device!

Acoustic insulation ARB TPMS 3xARB air compressors After cooler Air tank On-board OCD pressure air/water cleaning Additional 50L fuel Carpet in doors ABE 2x1kg Waeco 28L modified fridge Battery 4x26ah Solar 120w Victron MPPT 100/20 DC-DC 18amps 175amp jumper plug Awning 6x255/60R18

Super job well done and thank you for sharing how it was done, more photos would have made the thread even better.

I use https://imgur.com/ for all my photos easy to use and add to your threads.

Looks as good as the one I had done professionally a couple of years ago.

https://www.freel2.com/forum/topic15313-1680.html

It wasn’t worth my time even attempting it for what I paid. (Now Sold). 2008 Freelander 2 (Nazca Sand) SE TD4 Auto. Statutory write off & on WOVR for hail damage but still road legal.
171037Km as of 09/05/22
Superchips Bluefin Flash
Nanocom Evo II (also sold)

Yes it looks very good. Way above my pay grade. I never got passed the sticky back plastic on blue Peter