Those poor families and loved ones of the 96 who lost their lives. Been lied to for 27 years and finally have a true verdict. Very, very upsetting watching the news last night and I'm not ashamed to say I shed a tear or two. I just hope that that they can now get justice against those responsible and those that tried to cover it up. Past: FL2 TD4 HSE Auto
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I was there two years earlier in in the same pens to watch Leeds v Coventry in the FA Cup Semi Final. I'm 6ft 5" and used to be a prop forward and I felt uneasy and nervous at how packed it was.

Sadly the lies and cover up by the authorities might mean we never get he 100% truth for this tragedy. There are a lot of factors here - stadium design has got to be high on the list. But the one thing that I would like answering TRUTHFULLY is why the decision as made to open the gate, for me the single major factor in causing this tragedy along with those fences.

The authorities and Sheffield Wednesday are being cited. But what about the FA who mandated those fences. And who gave the ground a licence!

It must be hard for younger supporters going to todays improved fenceless stadiums to get the head round how it could happen.
I've been in the that part of Hillsborough and I still dont really get it.

At that time the police had a general 'fear' of the fans that thankfully isnt really seen now. At work
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I am not a football fan but to me it looks like a typical disaster scenario where a number of things come together to create the situation. Why did they open the gates, why was the fence built like that, could the police have seen the overall picture emerging, why did it take the ambulance services so long to show up, who designed the stadium etc etc. With 20/20 hindsight it's easy to ask these questions but when you are in the thick of an unfolding tragedy of it it's a different story. I just hope we learn lessons and it doesn't turn into a hunt for scapegoats. 3 x FL1 2 manual + 1 auto
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Couldn't agree more with you dorsetfreelander. Based on my experiences 2 years earlier i would say that a load of excited fans had arrived late to the ground and were faced with a very narrow path to the turnstiles. There is (was?) a small beck stopping anyone spreading out. So people were getting squashed outside as they will have done for most semi finals there (and what was the case when I was there).

But then a decision was made to open the gates - I don't know the exact reasons but I am assuming they assessed fan safety outside. Given the layout of inside it was possible to go in any pen so what do you do - head for the middle. And the middle got too full but no one could escape any where.

The rest is a tragedy

I think had the police been honest in the original inquiry and inquest then there would not have been the heartache of the families and the huge costs involved. The original verdict should have been misadventure and a full investigation of the circumstances, some now retired senior officers may not have become senior officers. My opinion still is misadventure, yes there were actions that eventually caused the deaths, whether they amount to manslaughter? I don't have that evidence, but certainly conspiracy to pervert the cause of justice, and perverting the cause of justice would seem to be reasonable charges.
I somehow doubt that there is or was a political cover up, though easy to blame Maggie Thatcher for the start of a political cover up I don't believe that was in her nature, the cover up started at South Yorkshire Police Headquarters and to be honest it was a brilliant exercise in propaganda, bullying and secretiveness on the polices behalf that lasted through three changes of parliamentary power, even the Labour party who one would have expected to have found the truth didn't.
With the fans outside, difficult to blame, difficult not to, they were late, they wanted to get in, they weren't there to be told to wait, their only interest was to watch the match and nothing was going to stand in their way, even if they were told they were killing people I doubt it would have sunk in.
Looking at it clinically it is 27 years of the worst and he best endeavours of human behaviour. my PC is slightly to the right of Genghis
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Agree with all the above. Terrible decision to open the gates but one surely that was well-intended in that split second.

A perfect storm of poor planning, unsafe ground, unexpected events, little contingency planning, panic and terrible choices as events unfolded.

As to the cover up, in my opinion a combination of Duckenfield's lack of match-commander experience and unbelievable arrogance started a ball rolling which he felt he couldn't stop. And when Thatcher endorsed the lie he thought he'd got away with it.
Different times I guess. Football fans had a terrible reputation, hooliganism had been rife (that's why the pens were fenced in the first place) and Thatcher was very much in bed with the police. And to top it all off, the media further endorsed the lie, presumably at Thatcher's request.

Although many people and organisations share the blame, in my view Duckenfield is at the centre of this. Further evidence of his arrogance is in the many altered police statements (ordered by him), the vast majority of which were hiding relatively trivial criticisms, ie "radio reception was poor" or "supervision was chaotic". He'd started the lie and did everything to avoid criticism of the police and ultimately him.
It is interesting that Duckenfield was backed by his own superiors though. Although a very senior officer, there were several ranks above him who _must_ have known the truth, at least eventually. Today I think Duckenfield would have been thrown under the bus to save their own skins. There is thankfully a lot more personal accountability rather than trying to protect a corporate image.

As said by others, if Duckenfield had just told the truth most of this could have been avoided. It was a terrible tragedy that he caused, albeit aggravated by other factors which then fell into place.

too many people in police uniforms rying to save their arses over incorrect choices made on the day

Nobody should loose their life, following a sport, be that through something like this or thugs using it as a excuse to have a fight and stab innocent fans sat having a drink in Turkey Former Mod/Member, with the most post & Chicken George Arch nemesis

Edited with hindsight.

Last edited by Jimboland on 28th Apr 2016 7:38 pm. Edited 1 time in total

Why don't you inform us then? Past: FL2 TD4 HSE Auto
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sorry to hear your loss, having it dragged up in all avenues can't be easy

with all due respect subject like these, do drag out peoples opinions rightly or wrongly, pc or not pc and will continue to be discussed, and to be honest i feel it will never be answered 100%,

it might be best if those effected by this don't read it, i'm sure you know the truth, or have strong opinions of what went on been on scene, but the non effected will forever cast their opinions, just like any other major thing that happens in life its discussed Former Mod/Member, with the most post & Chicken George Arch nemesis